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	<title>Comments on: The Gooden contract</title>
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	<description>Musings from a Cleveland sports fan</description>
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		<title>By: Randall</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-319</link>
		<dc:creator>Randall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 31 Oct 2006 07:27:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-319</guid>
		<description>A few points:  First off, I agree wholeheartedly with Joel that you have to look at each deal in terms of what the available alternative was.  This applies to the Gooden contract, but it also applies to the moves Ferry made last offseason. 

Once the Cav&#039;s overtures to the more ideally suited players (shooters) failed, they were left to sign Hughes.  They had to pay a premium for his services because he could have commanded more from the Wizards.  In hindsight, it looks like Joe Johnson would have been the best fit of that crop, but we must remember what Atlanta eventually had to give up to get him in a sign and trade,  That simply would not have been feasable for the Cavs.

The same holds true for the point guard search last year.  What exactly were the alternatives?  The guys we wouldn&#039;t, or couldn&#039;t, sign all ended up being busts.  Perhaps Sam Cassel would have helped, but hindsight is definitely 20/20 there. 

The &#039;worst&#039; signing, economically speaking, was Ilguaskas.  But Ilguaskas was our second best offensive player for most of the season.  His defense started out strong but suffered as the season went on.  In the playoffs, he was clearly not fully recovered from the sprained ankle he suffered 10 days before the end of the season.  Hopefully the fatigue issue will be further addressed this season.  It seems the organization will take a cue from the Heat, who did a brilliant job of resting their injured players throughout the season.  From what I&#039;ved heard, the Cavs will be more flexible with their frtoncourt rotation this year, which clearly paves the way for Z to get more rest.

Overall, you have to look at last year&#039;s offseason moves in the context of the organization.  Perhaps Ferry could have gone &quot;cheap&quot; and taken a longer term approach, but with the Lebron contract extension looming he could not afford to get anything but the very best players available even if he had to overspend a little to do it.  Truth is, he didn&#039;t overspend so much as overextend the lengths of the contracts, in each case by one extra year.  But until someone puts forth exactly what better moves the Cavs could have made with their money, both last year and this year, I don&#039;t think you can put too much of a knock on Ferry.  Lebron, after all, is here for four more years.  And make no mistake, no contract will ever cripple the cap situation more than Snow&#039;s (although Newble&#039;s is a cose second).  

Back to the Gooden signing:  The single most important factor with the Gooden contract is his age.  The deal he signed is likely for the best three years of his career.  He is a fairly rare commodity at any age, but there are damned few players of that quality that you can sign for three years during their prime for less than 9 million per year.  And again, just look at the alternatives.  Look at what will be available next year, or the year after that.  The free agent market is perrenially littered with players on the decline looking for mullti year, multi-million dollar deals.  Again, spend that money more wisely.  I dare you.

p.s.  feel free to footnote/link your sources</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A few points:  First off, I agree wholeheartedly with Joel that you have to look at each deal in terms of what the available alternative was.  This applies to the Gooden contract, but it also applies to the moves Ferry made last offseason. </p>
<p>Once the Cav&#8217;s overtures to the more ideally suited players (shooters) failed, they were left to sign Hughes.  They had to pay a premium for his services because he could have commanded more from the Wizards.  In hindsight, it looks like Joe Johnson would have been the best fit of that crop, but we must remember what Atlanta eventually had to give up to get him in a sign and trade,  That simply would not have been feasable for the Cavs.</p>
<p>The same holds true for the point guard search last year.  What exactly were the alternatives?  The guys we wouldn&#8217;t, or couldn&#8217;t, sign all ended up being busts.  Perhaps Sam Cassel would have helped, but hindsight is definitely 20/20 there. </p>
<p>The &#8216;worst&#8217; signing, economically speaking, was Ilguaskas.  But Ilguaskas was our second best offensive player for most of the season.  His defense started out strong but suffered as the season went on.  In the playoffs, he was clearly not fully recovered from the sprained ankle he suffered 10 days before the end of the season.  Hopefully the fatigue issue will be further addressed this season.  It seems the organization will take a cue from the Heat, who did a brilliant job of resting their injured players throughout the season.  From what I&#8217;ved heard, the Cavs will be more flexible with their frtoncourt rotation this year, which clearly paves the way for Z to get more rest.</p>
<p>Overall, you have to look at last year&#8217;s offseason moves in the context of the organization.  Perhaps Ferry could have gone &#8220;cheap&#8221; and taken a longer term approach, but with the Lebron contract extension looming he could not afford to get anything but the very best players available even if he had to overspend a little to do it.  Truth is, he didn&#8217;t overspend so much as overextend the lengths of the contracts, in each case by one extra year.  But until someone puts forth exactly what better moves the Cavs could have made with their money, both last year and this year, I don&#8217;t think you can put too much of a knock on Ferry.  Lebron, after all, is here for four more years.  And make no mistake, no contract will ever cripple the cap situation more than Snow&#8217;s (although Newble&#8217;s is a cose second).  </p>
<p>Back to the Gooden signing:  The single most important factor with the Gooden contract is his age.  The deal he signed is likely for the best three years of his career.  He is a fairly rare commodity at any age, but there are damned few players of that quality that you can sign for three years during their prime for less than 9 million per year.  And again, just look at the alternatives.  Look at what will be available next year, or the year after that.  The free agent market is perrenially littered with players on the decline looking for mullti year, multi-million dollar deals.  Again, spend that money more wisely.  I dare you.</p>
<p>p.s.  feel free to footnote/link your sources</p>
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		<title>By: Drew Gooden: officially a Cav &#171; The Disappointment Zone</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-117</link>
		<dc:creator>Drew Gooden: officially a Cav &#171; The Disappointment Zone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Sep 2006 22:20:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-117</guid>
		<description>[...] I like the contract, for reasons explained here. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] I like the contract, for reasons explained here. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Josh</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-52</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 18 Aug 2006 01:22:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-52</guid>
		<description>I appreciate your thoughtful reply.  I&#039;ll address a few of the issues you&#039;ve raised:

1) I don&#039;t think you can look at head to head regular season records as a barometer of how a team will perform in the future.  The Heat had an awful regular season record against the other division leaders in the East and Western conference.  

2)  My comments were not meant to indicate that I don&#039;t believe the Cavs will have a successful season -- just that this core group of players will never reach an NBA Final without major changes.    I think even a terrible GM like Ferry can eek out a 50 win team with the cap space he had to work with last year plus Lebron.   

Unfortunately in what i gather was an impulsive attempt to please Lebron he spent all of his money at once and left himself little room to adjust in the years ahead.  Hughes is an okay player but not really a great fit with Lebron.  Z is a very limited center who most importantly doesn&#039;t excell in the up-tempo game that Lebron and Varejo seem to excell at.    I disagree that Z is tradable for anymore then another team&#039;s washed up player like a Chris Webber.  I think if Z or Hughes could have fetched them true assets in return Ferry would have moved them this summer.   I&#039;d be hard pressed to name an upper tier player that the Cavs could acquire for Z.

I consider the Heat the likely team to come out of the East next year.  Shaq is of course declining but they&#039;ll be smart and only play him 55 games so he&#039;s rested for the playoffs.  Sure the long term future of the Heat is uncertain but keep in mind Riley already broke down this team once and added Odom, Caron Butler and Wade.  Having Wade, Haslem and cap space will give them an opportunity to rebuild around Wade with a fuller understanding of the types of players Wade needs around him.  Miami will always be a more attractive place for a Free Agent then  Cleveland.

Lastly, it sounds like I like the Bulls a lot more then you.  I really like Deng and Nocioni&#039;s games and expect major improvement from them next year.   Plus, I think PJ Brown is vastly underrated.   If only Paxson can move Ben Gordon before all of his value plummets, they&#039;ll be in good shape.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I appreciate your thoughtful reply.  I&#8217;ll address a few of the issues you&#8217;ve raised:</p>
<p>1) I don&#8217;t think you can look at head to head regular season records as a barometer of how a team will perform in the future.  The Heat had an awful regular season record against the other division leaders in the East and Western conference.  </p>
<p>2)  My comments were not meant to indicate that I don&#8217;t believe the Cavs will have a successful season &#8212; just that this core group of players will never reach an NBA Final without major changes.    I think even a terrible GM like Ferry can eek out a 50 win team with the cap space he had to work with last year plus Lebron.   </p>
<p>Unfortunately in what i gather was an impulsive attempt to please Lebron he spent all of his money at once and left himself little room to adjust in the years ahead.  Hughes is an okay player but not really a great fit with Lebron.  Z is a very limited center who most importantly doesn&#8217;t excell in the up-tempo game that Lebron and Varejo seem to excell at.    I disagree that Z is tradable for anymore then another team&#8217;s washed up player like a Chris Webber.  I think if Z or Hughes could have fetched them true assets in return Ferry would have moved them this summer.   I&#8217;d be hard pressed to name an upper tier player that the Cavs could acquire for Z.</p>
<p>I consider the Heat the likely team to come out of the East next year.  Shaq is of course declining but they&#8217;ll be smart and only play him 55 games so he&#8217;s rested for the playoffs.  Sure the long term future of the Heat is uncertain but keep in mind Riley already broke down this team once and added Odom, Caron Butler and Wade.  Having Wade, Haslem and cap space will give them an opportunity to rebuild around Wade with a fuller understanding of the types of players Wade needs around him.  Miami will always be a more attractive place for a Free Agent then  Cleveland.</p>
<p>Lastly, it sounds like I like the Bulls a lot more then you.  I really like Deng and Nocioni&#8217;s games and expect major improvement from them next year.   Plus, I think PJ Brown is vastly underrated.   If only Paxson can move Ben Gordon before all of his value plummets, they&#8217;ll be in good shape.</p>
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		<title>By: disappointmentzone</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-51</link>
		<dc:creator>disappointmentzone</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Aug 2006 05:14:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-51</guid>
		<description>Josh, 

You are right that the Gooden contract is not without ramifications, but there are a few things to consider: First, last season the Cavs won 50+ games and came within a rebound of making the ECF, where they would have met a Miami team they had tied in the season series, and then Dallas, another team the Cavs split a season series against. The core of the team has remained in tact by signing Gooden. 

Second, there were no other options available to the Cavs on the free agent market. Reggie Evans is nice, but he&#039;s not nearly in the same class as Gooden. Had the Cavs signed Gooden to a one-year contract for the mid-level exception he would have lost all trade value. Keeping him is good. Keeping him and keeping his trade value is even better. His contract--assuming it&#039;s front-loaded--makes trading him a cinch.

The only worry the Cavs should have with respect to the salary cap is what&#039;ll happen next year with Varejao. I have legitimate concerns about if the Cavs will be willing to sign him if they cannot first clear some space under the cap. The Jones, Marhall, Snow, and Gooden contracts all end in 2009--a crucial offseason for the team--and I wouldn&#039;t be surprised if Jones is gone before this season is over. Marshall is still valuable, at least until another shooter emerges on the roster. No one will take Snow. Hughes is tradable. And so is Z. 

I guess our difference of opinion comes down to whether this team can compete with the best in the East as is. I think it can, especially if Shannon Brown develops into a quality player. The Pistons are going to have huge problems filling the gap left by Ben Wallace. Miami is in a pickle with Shaq, which is aging pretty fast, and their only decent backup is another aging former star. And their PG is Gary Payton, backed up by Jason Williams. Without Haslem and Wade Miami is nothing, and soon all Miami will have is Haslem and Wade. The Wizards are OK, but don&#039;t play defense. The Bulls got better, but I think everyone is distracted by Ben Wallace--this team still has roster issues. 

It&#039;s good to remember that last season was Mike Browns&#039; first as 1) a head coach and 2) as the Cavs&#039; coach. A lot of time had to be spent working through the pains that come with those two things. Coaching in the NBA matters and I think the Cavs will improve if only because Mike Brown will improve.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Josh, </p>
<p>You are right that the Gooden contract is not without ramifications, but there are a few things to consider: First, last season the Cavs won 50+ games and came within a rebound of making the ECF, where they would have met a Miami team they had tied in the season series, and then Dallas, another team the Cavs split a season series against. The core of the team has remained in tact by signing Gooden. </p>
<p>Second, there were no other options available to the Cavs on the free agent market. Reggie Evans is nice, but he&#8217;s not nearly in the same class as Gooden. Had the Cavs signed Gooden to a one-year contract for the mid-level exception he would have lost all trade value. Keeping him is good. Keeping him and keeping his trade value is even better. His contract&#8211;assuming it&#8217;s front-loaded&#8211;makes trading him a cinch.</p>
<p>The only worry the Cavs should have with respect to the salary cap is what&#8217;ll happen next year with Varejao. I have legitimate concerns about if the Cavs will be willing to sign him if they cannot first clear some space under the cap. The Jones, Marhall, Snow, and Gooden contracts all end in 2009&#8211;a crucial offseason for the team&#8211;and I wouldn&#8217;t be surprised if Jones is gone before this season is over. Marshall is still valuable, at least until another shooter emerges on the roster. No one will take Snow. Hughes is tradable. And so is Z. </p>
<p>I guess our difference of opinion comes down to whether this team can compete with the best in the East as is. I think it can, especially if Shannon Brown develops into a quality player. The Pistons are going to have huge problems filling the gap left by Ben Wallace. Miami is in a pickle with Shaq, which is aging pretty fast, and their only decent backup is another aging former star. And their PG is Gary Payton, backed up by Jason Williams. Without Haslem and Wade Miami is nothing, and soon all Miami will have is Haslem and Wade. The Wizards are OK, but don&#8217;t play defense. The Bulls got better, but I think everyone is distracted by Ben Wallace&#8211;this team still has roster issues. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s good to remember that last season was Mike Browns&#8217; first as 1) a head coach and 2) as the Cavs&#8217; coach. A lot of time had to be spent working through the pains that come with those two things. Coaching in the NBA matters and I think the Cavs will improve if only because Mike Brown will improve.</p>
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		<title>By: Josh</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-50</link>
		<dc:creator>Josh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Aug 2006 04:29:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-50</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think you can look at Gooden&#039;s contract as an isolated variable -- it might be worth a fair amount given his production but when you put this contract next to all of the other bad contracts that eat up the Cavs cap space, I wonder why they are further limiting their flexibility down the road in 2007 and 2008 (i&#039;ll assume in 2009 this contract is tradeable when it is about to expire)?

I&#039;d compare this signing to the Jefferies signing in New York.  It wouldn&#039;t be so bad if the team wasn&#039;t already in such bad cap shape.  As it stands Ferry has jammed this team with multi year deals (Jones, Marshall, Hughes, Z, Gooden) that  other teams will not want to absorb in sign and trades (see Golden State).   It&#039;s stuck in the status quo, which i don&#039;t think will ever get you past the Eastern Conference Finals.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think you can look at Gooden&#8217;s contract as an isolated variable &#8212; it might be worth a fair amount given his production but when you put this contract next to all of the other bad contracts that eat up the Cavs cap space, I wonder why they are further limiting their flexibility down the road in 2007 and 2008 (i&#8217;ll assume in 2009 this contract is tradeable when it is about to expire)?</p>
<p>I&#8217;d compare this signing to the Jefferies signing in New York.  It wouldn&#8217;t be so bad if the team wasn&#8217;t already in such bad cap shape.  As it stands Ferry has jammed this team with multi year deals (Jones, Marshall, Hughes, Z, Gooden) that  other teams will not want to absorb in sign and trades (see Golden State).   It&#8217;s stuck in the status quo, which i don&#8217;t think will ever get you past the Eastern Conference Finals.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-49</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Aug 2006 01:48:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">https://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-49</guid>
		<description>I like him, but I still kinda think that contract it too much to pay him. Maybe you should do a Varejao vs. Gooden article... that would be interesting. I dunno, maybe it wouldn&#039;t work. I&#039;d have to think about it more (which I happen to be too lazy to do right now). But it&#039;s worth a thought.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like him, but I still kinda think that contract it too much to pay him. Maybe you should do a Varejao vs. Gooden article&#8230; that would be interesting. I dunno, maybe it wouldn&#8217;t work. I&#8217;d have to think about it more (which I happen to be too lazy to do right now). But it&#8217;s worth a thought.</p>
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		<title>By: GoTeamsGo Sports Fan Forum</title>
		<link>http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/#comment-48</link>
		<dc:creator>GoTeamsGo Sports Fan Forum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 15 Aug 2006 15:52:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Drew Gooden Cavs Contract&lt;/strong&gt;

Great writeup about [url=http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/]Drew Gooden&#039;s contract[/url] by Joel Witmer at [url=http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/]The Disapp...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Drew Gooden Cavs Contract</strong></p>
<p>Great writeup about [url=http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/2006/08/14/the-gooden-contract/]Drew Gooden&#8217;s contract[/url] by Joel Witmer at [url=http://disappointmentzone.wordpress.com/]The Disapp&#8230;</p>
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